Diamond stays vs lower shrouds

[Geoff]

'Timeless' #50 has diamond stay rigging. Standing the mast and fixing the forestay has never been a problem. When I got the boat, I followed Ray's instructions, walked it up, put some load on with the jib halyard and pinned the forestay. I wondered why it seemed harder for some.

'Missy' #111 has a near new mast, and has lower shrouds. All the standing rigging is heavier than #50.

Anyway, I swapped the mast and rigging over onto Timeless. After I set up the rigging, I let down the mast, then re-stood. Huge difference in effort required in preloading the mast enough to pin the forestay.

So I wondered how much of the different reports of how hard it is to rig up is related to what type of rigging the boat has? Feedback, anyone?

Other wonderings came to mind too. I saw in one topic that Ian B said that diamond stay rigging is the most common on our boats.

I wonder if that was standard and lowers were an optional extra at ordering? Or were some retro-fitted? Or was one type standard for a time then swapped to the other? I am doubtful of this one only because I am pretty sure some early boats had lowers (#9 Teria?) but #50 has diamonds, then #111 has lowers. But maybe one or more of these are the exceptions in their range.

I think there are some occasional boats that have different customisations to their rigging also.

Idle curiosities only, but I'm interested in what others have, especially relative to their sail number.

[Peter T]

Interesting Geoff. I have not looked at my rigging as yet but I notice that some boats have two sets of shroud
" U " bolts fitted each side and some have just the one each side. I have just finished pulling every nut and bolt out from my topsides prior to the repairs to the gel coat cracks and repaint of my topsides, cockpit etc ( a very big job by the way).
However, I noticed when removing the shroud U bolts that they are just fitted through the side deck with a solid,
( about 1 inch thick) block of timber sitting under the deck. I wonder if this is strong enough and the same as your #111, and does this mean that I have one or the other styles of shrouds ? Mine being #114.
A photo of your rig would be most helpful if that is possible mate. Cheers

[Geoff]

Hi Peter,

I think that Investigators with 2 sets of chain plates each side would be very rare. They would be non-standard and definitely an 'aftermarket' addition.

I would like to do it one day maybe.

In other topics it has been pointed out that upper and lower shrouds going to separate chain plates (as you described) would give the most absolute redundancy in case of either shroud or chain plate failure. Even though it has been touted, I don't know of anyone who has actually done it.

On both my boats the chain plate is mounted as you have described. The difference I am asking about is determined by how many turnbuckles you have attached to each chain plate. If one only each side, it is the diamond stay setup, if two, uppers and lower shrouds are in use.

The setup with lower shrouds seems more solid, but that could be illusion on my part. It's definitely harder to hook up the forestay, at least for me. It still comes back to a single point of failure, and from other topics it seems more prevalent for chain plates to fail than shrouds?

Ozzie had a shroud fail I think, but I don't know of any others. But there have been a few posts about the chain plates needing to be replaced.

[Peter T]

Thanks Geoff. Just went fishing through my photos and found a shot of what was David's "Private eyes" which has the two shrouds as you describe. I am sure mine only has the one.
See below. It is amazing the differences one finds.

[Geoff]

Hi Peter,

Yes, my early boat has one (diamond stay setup) but my later one has two (upper and lower shrouds). So it looks like it probably wasn't related to production dates, but maybe an offered choice?